Give the Buffs to the Spark, make Valk dmg/tanky

Counting Offensive Stance is not "annoying", since you have to use it when you activate the ability if you want to use it at its maximum, while "any other assault/elite" of the Lion CAN NOT due 45 damage to ANY other unit in the game: you can do it to weak units but not to elites or legendary ones. Moreover the point of that skill is not to have an healthy Valkyrie at the end, but more to kill the enemy higher AP unit with your attack. So that you "sacrifice" about 100 AP to kill/hurt badly 150-250 AP of the enemy.

Only someone who hasnt played with incarnation of justice valk can maake a comment like this.

First I completely agree with Dragon that counting offensive stance is annoying you know why? 2 reasons.

1: ppl keep saying valk does 45 dmg if well used. Well is it your skill that determines that the enemy will leave a unit with 30hp and another unit with 15hp in the killing range of a IoJ valk? no it isnt its stupidity from the other player and luck, never happened to me. What happens is a unit with 20hp and other unit with 10hp and in the kill zone. Thats 30 dmg and 10 taken not 45 and no dmg taken (20 dmg taken if second unit has more than 15hp).

2: Those big units that you guys say that we can hit 30hp for, you guys realise that most of them have nice parry bonuses, for example a GG vs a valk with have a high chance to parry 1 of the attacks, a golem or warg will prolly not be without def stance so theres a problem right there too, most big units with def stance will prolly parry one of the hits. Now you're thinking "well then surround him" so now ur saying that IoJ valk is nice only when in range of a big unit that are surrounded -> useless.

In conclusion, my experience with IoJ valk is mostly:
Valk activates incarnation hot justice: roll 9 of 90 success
Valk activates off sta
Valk hits big unit for 15 15-75 success
Big unit hits valk for 10 45-90 success
Valk hits big unit for 15 68-65 fail

GG because most of the time you would be using IoJ to protect or take out vital unit.

People need to start playing more lion without abusing archers(+2). Especially with mages and see how hard the game is.

Also lets not forget that valk requires 3 pts to do this skill, which means you need to keep units alive and together, more conditioning of play.

Well, I've never played WITH a Valk lvl4 with Incarnation, but I've played AGAINST a Valk lvl4 with Incarnation so many times that I've lost count. I usually play with Wolfen or Acheron and either with an elite or a legendary unit in my army and the Valk can be very strong if well played: certain times the enemy doesn't even want to attack with her! He just place her in contact with 1-2 of my units with or without a def stance on, usually blocking a path or slowing down my units and either I lost a turn and I become a pincushion for the supporting archers/mages or I try to disengage suffering the counter attack (and I don't know if I'm unlucky but it hits very often...). Don't forget also that the Lion starts almost always the turn first, so you can also "double" move the Valk and activate the ability the second turn. Especially against Wolfen is very strong, since they have usually fewer units in play, against Acheron is still very strong against the Golem and the Skull and, also if I played with armies without elites/legendary units around, I saw a nice use of her ability to simply suffer less damage from the Gargoyles/Hunters and block a path leading to your archers/mages (that will erase the enemy unit at the start of the following turn).
However, I don't know about using it against other Lion armies, since I'm not playing Lion often and they also have high par units so she's probably less effective... I'm lvling one up now to lvl4 just to test it directly.

but I've played AGAINST a Valk lvl4 with Incarnation so many times that I've lost count.

in both curreny and previous patch i saw ONE lev 4 valkyrie ... and she died and killed nothing

ok i invested some cyans in lev 4 counteratack tree valkyrie ...
indeed Deep Blue - Ambidex is hell complex skill ... and can be great - but unfortunately it looks hell random even in training missions

ok i invested some cyans in lev 4 counteratack tree valkyrie ...

complaining without testing is not exacly good idea

i knew that she have PAR 11 and even lower TOU but i was simply curious if ambidex really work that way DB described.

...and belive me that with it current mechanic - if anyone will play some matches with this buils - ambidex will be nerfed to the ground While on Glassy Valkyrie it can be ok... and quite ocasional - on any other unit it would be devastating as hell.


to be honest i may even want to try her against Wolfens - but my current ratio looks to good to risk that at the moment

complaining without testing is not exacly good idea

kudos for not being another of those theory masters that infest this forum I think it really shines vs wolven as trying to attack her would deal a tremendous damage back ( i tried it as well in closed as i said). That build is especially good if you are interested into having a nice regeneration bot that is extremely annoying if attacked.

complaining without testing is not exacly good idea

kudos for not being another of those theory masters that infest this forum

Hey, what's wrong about theorycrafting without having tried stuff?!
It's fun!

(In fact I seem to theorize a lot with my whole 20 games played )

kudos for not being another of those theory masters that infest this forum I think it really shines vs wolven as trying to attack her would deal a tremendous damage back ( i tried it as well in closed as i said). That build is especially good if you are interested into having a nice regeneration bot that is extremely annoying if attacked.

But its still hell based on luck to be honest - becouse Valk dies mostly after 3'rd attack so she needs some parries to be effective and not only pay of before death

and charging with her + deffensive stance is not always good idea

kudos for not being another of those theory masters that infest this forum I think it really shines vs wolven as trying to attack her would deal a tremendous damage back ( i tried it as well in closed as i said). That build is especially good if you are interested into having a nice regeneration bot that is extremely annoying if attacked.

But its still hell based on luck to be honest - becouse Valk dies mostly after 3'rd attack so she needs some parries to be effective and not only pay of before death

and charging with her + deffensive stance is not always good idea

I have a lvl 4 Valk built this way. I have not had a good opportunity for counter-attack yet, but she was good value while buffed anyway. Was doing 12 damage so got to finish and pursue a bit. That is very good melee damage for lion.

I have a lvl 5 IoJ Valk w/ Master Fencer. I think she is probably better because she can deal with fat boys. IoJ is actually pretty handy even against Zerg builds. 10 damage will rarely be more than normal for the Valk, and 2 x 15 is way better output than she could deal without it. Even destroying a HB skele and pursuing can be worth it in a game sense. I took Favourable Auspices with this one so she has other uses anyway.

Valks are very useful at any level in my experience except level 3, take 4 or stay at 2 in that case I think. I think Vivacity would be a good starting skill for a Valk. I would also like +1 PAR on them, but that may be asking a little much. There lack of any exceptional stats means they are pretty easily cheap shotted.