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Do you enjoying playing agasint Golems?

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Hemata

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Re: Do you enjoying playing agasint Golems?

PostSat Mar 29, 2014 5:28 am

Errol Flynn wrote:
Hey Hemata,

If you think the basic units for Ram are bad you are doing something wrong. The archers are very useful, softening allows more efficient use of melee units, they can kill units attempting to flee and soft units behind enemy melee. They are cheap and at close range they are as good as any archer. It is usually easier to use them at close range because as Ram you have good cheap blockers and your archers are more expendable than they are for the other factions.
Skeleton warriors are awesome, you really need to try some with Hard Boiled if you have not already. The Garg is very mobile and very powerful, learning how to use this unit well is a big advantage over many teams. The Black Paladin and Necro are extremely good units at any level. They can be vulnerable to enemy missile but that is the case for many units in other factions also. Necros are fragile but don't usually have to take big risks to be very useful to you. If you have played 50+ games and think Rams best bet is the Golem I think you should try the other factions, they may well suit your play style better.


To go through the points.

1. I said early Ram is bad, not that their basic units are bad. Their basic units all have their role.

2. Except for the Archers. Our archers are so....friggin'.....useless. When I have a skeletal archer have 75% chance to hit on a single target the closest he can get to it without being in melee, and the Human archers can get 85% at a significantly longer distance than that, the unit itself becomes very useless even if it is "cheaper." The only exception to this is with Somatic transfer, at which point they become very useful indeed. Otherwise they tend to do more harm(Ram use a lot of swarming melee units) with scattering than they do good.

3. I agree, skeleton warriors are amazing things, even before hard-boiled, but only for the reason that they are very cheap blockers/swarmers. Plus later on they become even better meatshields(hard boiled) and can fuel priests and paladins incase they need the juice(Martyr)

4. Garg is a very exceptional assault unit, having flight which lets it start out with an improved version of mobility. It may be squishy, but most assault units and it can still do some intense damage. It has its uses at just about any level, but a garg alone will not win you a battle.

5. The Black pally and Necro are NOT extremely good units at any level. The Paladin early on is good as a defensive unit, a glorified meat shield who can actually deal damage back. Possessed and Fierce help with this most definitely, but until it has Occult erosion, that's all it is. And even then once the threat of mages are gone(or don't exist in the first place) it goes back to its former role. Exhausting touch and somatic transfer at level 4, however, are some of the best possible miracles one could hope for in an army like the Ram. One makes an entire unit virtually useless which can easily tip the odds, and the other lets you have up to two other units per paladin at time be able to take and dish punishment just like them. Match with archers and your archers go from atrociously bad to actually very useful units.

6. To go to the Necro, it is a very, very iffy topic on its use at lower levels. Early on, it can only place a very, very obscenely weak unit down per turn with a max of two whose use ranges from emergency meatshield to encirclement buddies. Level 2 they can get a heal or they can turn skeletons into bombs. Both are useful, I prefer the heal personally, but they lack the mana to keep up with their new found potential. Level 3 is where they start kicking. Two puny skellies a turn or a heal or a bomb. Let them charge up their mana longer and be capable of doing some intense stuff. Level 4 is meh, damage is good but it's not that damaging, though putrefaction can be helpful. Level 5 can help with the damage or give them the ability to cast through walls, both are very useful. Later on as well your muppets can get somatic transfer on them, AMAZING.

7. I am rank 19, I've played much more than 50 games. But I am saying that to a player who is using the weakest possible STARTING army, when they get a flesh golem and suddenly can do to their enemies what has been done to them, I don't blame them at all for enjoying it.

8. The entire thing that I am saying here is that Ram is a very poor starting army. An insanely poor starting army. Once you have experienced units then yes, Ram is by far one of the deadliest things you could possibly fight, even without a golem. But until you have those experienced units Ram are very easy to overpower because they don't have all of their tricks yet.
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Errol Flynn

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Re: Do you enjoying playing agasint Golems?

PostSat Mar 29, 2014 7:12 am

Sorry Hemata you obviously know your Ram. I always found ram good at 250 AP because numbers count even more at that AP usually. That also makes a lvl 1 necro pretty useful, he can do 2 puppets if he holds mana which is a pretty decent move.
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Saru

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Re: Do you enjoying playing agasint Golems?

PostSat Mar 29, 2014 5:18 pm

one lvl4 black paladin and he is done for damage = 0 (he still deals 3 damage thou :D)
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Dragon_Warrior

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Re: Do you enjoying playing agasint Golems?

PostSat Mar 29, 2014 5:28 pm

Saru wrote:one lvl4 black paladin and he is done for damage = 0 (he still deals 3 damage thou :D)

Ram is whole made from golem counters ;P
ign: Draconnor, Cynwall player, 23 years in computer games, 14 years in battle games, 8 years in Confrontation Universe, 4 years of making own battle games.
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Deuzerre

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Re: Do you enjoying playing agasint Golems?

PostSun Mar 30, 2014 10:23 am

Heh, tried a (lvl 1) golem.

Murdered by a guy with 4 archers dealing 7 dmg every turn. Ouch. Inluding the ones that hit twice + divine.

Basically, I received 2+2 (offensive stance) 2+2+2 (double shot) for an almsot dead golem in turn one :roll:
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Errol Flynn

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Re: Do you enjoying playing agasint Golems?

PostSun Mar 30, 2014 11:02 am

Deuzerre wrote:Heh, tried a (lvl 1) golem.

Murdered by a guy with 4 archers dealing 7 dmg every turn. Ouch. Inluding the ones that hit twice + divine.

Basically, I received 2+2 (offensive stance) 2+2+2 (double shot) for an almsot dead golem in turn one :roll:


Lol, good to see some people actively hunting Golems. They are currently at plague proportions. :lol:
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Deuzerre

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Re: Do you enjoying playing agasint Golems?

PostSun Mar 30, 2014 11:55 am

Well, to be honest, his build is almost OP.
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Almanro

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Re: Do you enjoying playing agasint Golems?

PostSun Mar 30, 2014 11:11 pm

I tried to play the Golem after the patch and I've to say they did a good work with it. Now it is much more balanced and much easier to deal with.

I played about a dozen of games and I won 5-6 of them, only 2 with at the end the Golem still with more than 50% HP, lost about 5-6 of which 3 with both my army and the enemy one reduced to only one standing (and not the Golem). Now you can't play it simply running to the enemy as before the patch or you'll get killed easily by most companies. Only company that I found that had serious problems with it was a Wolfen Zerg company without even a Ferocious unit out of 8-9 on the field, but then they were looking for it...

Regarding the build with 4 Alahan archers (lvl2-3) + 4 Guards (lvl2-3) is the strongest anti-legendary unit composition in the game: it can kill any legend in 1 turn and it is very strong against many other compositions. However if the enemy can charge your archers you'll lose (maybe)
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Dragon_Warrior

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Re: Do you enjoying playing agasint Golems?

PostMon Mar 31, 2014 12:04 am

imo its fixed in wrong way - now RAM have even easier way to deal with him but for lions and wolfens without certan builds its still the same...
fortunately while its so easy to counter him with special counters - i didn't meed any golem during last 10+ games...
ign: Draconnor, Cynwall player, 23 years in computer games, 14 years in battle games, 8 years in Confrontation Universe, 4 years of making own battle games.
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Almanro

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Re: Do you enjoying playing agasint Golems?

PostMon Mar 31, 2014 12:26 am

Not true. For the Lion is sufficient now to have a single lvl2 archer (and which composition doesn't have at least 1 lvl2 archer? Also in the lvl5 Mage standard comp I can usually see it!) and you can kill it, since its damage is so reduced (-2DAM allows many units to survive 2 attacks from it) that you can surround it and live happily ever after just waiting for your archer to finish it without losing HP to attack it to do just 1HP DAM... if it kills one of your unit, its very long pursuit range (1 square) can pose a problem to your archer only if you did something wrong... and then you start first with Lion vs Acheron like 90% of times!

Considering the Wolfen it is more difficult indeed, since a single Archer with Ferocious is sufficient, but it will take a while and you risk everything if you do the wrong move (two will be more than enough but are a lot of APs). Instead, now the Worg can win against the Golem (if the player doesn't surrender the match before starting, remembering the old situation) since the Golem needs to hit the Worg 4 times, while the Worg can do the same amount of damage to the Golem using correctly the Stances (and hoping not to lose the initiative the turn just after he used the Offensive one, but then the probability to start second is less than 40%).
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