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0.12.11 Balance suggestions by DW

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Lima

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Re: 0.12.11 Balance suggestions by DW

PostTue Apr 22, 2014 7:02 pm

Dragon_Warrior wrote:
Say you have 12mana on a lvl 5 mage that is injured and archer with 2xshot but at some range. You have 1 Divine favor and a valk with fav ausp, which will get the divine favor and which gets fav ausp

If you have Lev 5 Mage, Lev 2+ Valkyrie and Lev 3 bowman - than both my lion and ram companies are happy that you have almost 250+ ap in 3 units that can be torn apart by 2 Lions/Gargoyles ;P


thats a hypothetical situation to demonstate that the mage would much rather have divine favor than fav ausp while the bowman would do great most of the time with just fav ausp.
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Almanro

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Re: 0.12.11 Balance suggestions by DW

PostTue Apr 22, 2014 8:03 pm

Dragon_Warrior wrote:But i can't agree with that... only thing that enemy must have - is more units/activations - and its not so hard Vs 130ap unit.


It is not hard IF you're playing ONLY Zerg companies, otherwise, just one elite (Crane or Knights) will cost the same as the enemy mage, moreover, the Lion Mage player will have 3 Sparks for a total of 63-75 APs + other units for a total of about 8-9 units!!! Most of the companies will have less or equal units than the mage focused one!

Dragon_Warrior wrote:You simply need two suicide units that can be cost efective at killing mage with their wirst activations... currently when alahan have no resonable healing - Mage can be even killed in parts in two different turns ;)

For Alahan - Lion + Sparkling or Bowman + Lion or two Bowmans should be enough (8 hex of run and 4 + offensive makes hiding really hard :P)

For RAM Gargoyles + puppet block + bowman harras + scaterred swarm is also enough.


"You simply need two suicide units" AND the enemy messing up his formation, otherwise you'll have to pass through at least 2 units to get to the mage, and remember that you CAN'T avoid spell damage!

For Alahan: Lion can be blocked by other units, while archers have to move near your mage to see/attack him, but don't forget you have also either 2 Lions on your part to harass them or Seal of Dellarin and flying around Sparks... moreover, the mage function is to release the 4 Chastiment of Light and then die a glorious death, all your other units that will still be full health or near it will deal with the wounded enemy survivors...

For Ram: If you have 4-5 Skeleton HB + 1-2 Necros + Skeleton archers and/or Gargoyles then you can win (but you're playing Swarm! ;) ), otherwise, if you don't play swarm, your central unit/s in the army will always be heavily wounded/killed by the mage before his death, you can't hide it behind a wall or anywhere else! (e.g., Priest, high lvl Necros, Paladins, Valkirye, any unit can be killed or heavy wounded by a well played mage!)

DW, you should try to play some friendly matches with Lima against his Mage army and try to win with different armies beside the Acheron Swarm one, you'll see that is not so easy as it may seem! ;)
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Dragon_Warrior

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Re: 0.12.11 Balance suggestions by DW

PostTue Apr 22, 2014 10:37 pm

DW, you should try to play some friendly matches with Lima against his Mage army and try to win with different armies beside the Acheron Swarm one, you'll see that is not so easy as it may seem! ;)

I just played Vs 1st place Lion-Mage company ;P

had lot of fun when my necro killed off two wounded swordsmans at the end ;P
and im really not playing full zerg :P
screens below:
http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/331 ... 4888EA3CB/
http://cloud-3.steampowered.com/ugc/331 ... 108FB43ED/
http://cloud-3.steampowered.com/ugc/331 ... 9ADD70D39/ - no more mage
http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/331 ... 51F1DBE32/
http://cloud-3.steampowered.com/ugc/331 ... 961094514/

mage (lev5 focus) casted total of 3 or 4 chatisments... two first into gargoyle + skely as i remember - last one (with critical wounded mage on divine) Vs clustered army of skellys (i think that more thatn 7 units was hit) but it changed nothing... simply RAM have so much more TOU and HP that even one good placed Chatisment can't change the game. As i said many times before - each RAM unit is better version (more resilient, stronger, fear immune etc.) in case of 1v1 situations differences are minor and Alahan PAR looks nice... but PAR wont defend from Chatisment... while TOU and many cheap, dangerous and expendable units can.

When i play Wolfen i knew that when i loos second wolfen - i lost
When i play Lions i knew that when i don't lower enemy to 50% before real HtH starts - i los
When i play Ram... i can loose 1-2 units for nothing, block enemy key units with something expendable and still i have more units with probably better stats... and I smile when enemy wins his DIS roll nad chooses if he want to (try) save Mage, archers or a Lion... becouse he can activate and save only one :P


and
...why i should try to play Vs this with Wolfens that i consider hardly underpowered and i can agre without a game that they will loose.. Vs Mage, Vs my comp. Vs DB tide and Skydancers variation of it... and Vs many others Lion-Ram companies...

and if i manage to win with my lions company it will prove nothing becouse of mirror match... well maybe my Alahan company dont have a mage but it still is a mirror match. Moreover sparks with devotion moved at T2 would be nice mage counter on T1.


So AGAIN
Mage same as Alahan archers may be strong and sometimes easy to use, or may be even op... but they both are not even a match for real problem - Acheron :P
RAM may be slightly harder to play at this level but when player - he can deal with all other "op" units... and nerfing them (without more important fixes) will make Acheorn even more undefeated.
ign: Draconnor, Cynwall player, 23 years in computer games, 14 years in battle games, 8 years in Confrontation Universe, 4 years of making own battle games.
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skydancer

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Re: 0.12.11 Balance suggestions by DW

PostWed Apr 23, 2014 12:52 am

Alhan > Acheron i'll prove this week because of their perfect unit sinergy.

I'll show you this week. ;)

Btw my undead army could be easily beaten by proper lion counter, but i can't say the same for the lion army i'm playing right now.
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Dragon_Warrior

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Re: 0.12.11 Balance suggestions by DW

PostWed Apr 23, 2014 6:42 am

but i can't say the same for the lion army i'm playing right now.

I wish :P
but that one with two loses Vs RAM? :P
ign: Draconnor, Cynwall player, 23 years in computer games, 14 years in battle games, 8 years in Confrontation Universe, 4 years of making own battle games.
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skydancer

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Re: 0.12.11 Balance suggestions by DW

PostWed Apr 23, 2014 12:38 pm

Dragon_Warrior wrote:but that one with two loses Vs RAM? :P


That two loss come with another lion army. And the third one come vs wolfen ( :oops: ) that i play on a small map and understimated like a noob. :D
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Astralwyrm

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Re: 0.12.11 Balance suggestions by DW

PostWed Apr 23, 2014 12:43 pm

Psst the wolfen was me! >=D
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Dragon_Warrior

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Re: 0.12.11 Balance suggestions by DW

PostWed Apr 23, 2014 1:28 pm

That two loss come with another lion army.

I knew that you are sworn Lions enemy but - you lost twice (this week) with my current band and no way it was Alahan (well Skellys may indeed be previous lion warriors) ;P

while last week you crushed my wolfens 3 times :P
ign: Draconnor, Cynwall player, 23 years in computer games, 14 years in battle games, 8 years in Confrontation Universe, 4 years of making own battle games.
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skydancer

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Re: 0.12.11 Balance suggestions by DW

PostWed Apr 23, 2014 2:11 pm

I mean that i was playing with another lion army list not the actual one that i'm playing right now!
The two loss vs your undead made me think about army list composition to reach the perfect one i'm using now. ;)

Psst the wolfen was me! >=D

Yeah you play very well and made a great wolfen army. I mean that i play like noob, not you.
I lost because of the map and because i just play bad because i think lion vs wolfen is 99% an easy win. ;)
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Dragon_Warrior

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Re: 0.12.11 Balance suggestions by DW

PostWed Apr 23, 2014 2:15 pm

I mean that i was playing with another lion army list not the actual one that i'm playing right now!
The two loss vs your undead made me think about army list composition to reach the perfect one i'm using now. ;)

we will see :P

i noticed change between first and second game and assumet that second one was final :P
ign: Draconnor, Cynwall player, 23 years in computer games, 14 years in battle games, 8 years in Confrontation Universe, 4 years of making own battle games.
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