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Sigh...

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Deep Blue

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Re: Sigh...

PostWed Apr 02, 2014 9:11 am

Dragon_Warrior wrote:
I think the missile fire in this has way better mechanics than other games of its type. Be careful what you change with scatter Legulysse. People start threads about rare bad luck just after they rage quit a game. This should not lead to patching.

+this


++ this :D
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Legulysse

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Re: Sigh...

PostWed Apr 02, 2014 10:58 am

Don't worry, when I say small patch I mean a tiny adjustment on the individual % chance of scatter ;)
I also like the system as of now, I am just looking at the "target has 1% chance and everyone around has 10% chance even behind cover" situation.
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Dragon_Warrior

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Re: Sigh...

PostWed Apr 02, 2014 11:35 am

I am just looking at the "target has 1% chance and everyone around has 10% chance even behind cover" situation.
But its also OK

Hitting a unit rounded by 6 othe units should be harder that hitting the ring that 'protects' him. So you get 1% in place (necro for example) and 60% for hitting the rest (skellys)

But When you aim at the 'bodyguard' there is slightly bigger chance to hit central target (lets say 10%) but a total chance of hitting enemy is lowered from 61% to 31% - so its really good and gives additional decision to make.
ign: Draconnor, Cynwall player, 23 years in computer games, 14 years in battle games, 8 years in Confrontation Universe, 4 years of making own battle games.
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Legulysse

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Re: Sigh...

PostWed Apr 02, 2014 1:23 pm

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(It will really be a slight adjustment ;) )
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GardenOfSun

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Re: Sigh...

PostWed Apr 02, 2014 1:41 pm

Can't argue with that guys.

(Plus right now doesn't it also happen that in the 1% - 10% situation you can also scatter behind the targeted unit? That sounds far less sensible, together with the ignoring FOV part)
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Dragon_Warrior

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Re: Sigh...

PostWed Apr 02, 2014 2:28 pm

(Plus right now doesn't it also happen that in the 1% - 10% situation you can also scatter behind the targeted unit? That sounds far less sensible, together with the ignoring FOV part)

- Scattering behind? same as scatteing in front ;) Units are not the solid bocks covering whole vision.
- Scattering ignorinf the fov? Its same as tabletop option to attack hidden units with blast attack only if there is visible enemy in the same range. Simply you can't cheat the game that you see hidden enemy and shoot there with volley fire - but if you shoot to close visible target and scatter... additionaly all arrows reflected by armors/shields can also be quite harmfull to units close to initial target ;P

This really can be defended with resonalbe arguments ;P

(It will really be a slight adjustment ;) )

ok ok :P
ign: Draconnor, Cynwall player, 23 years in computer games, 14 years in battle games, 8 years in Confrontation Universe, 4 years of making own battle games.
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Jigoku

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Re: Sigh...

PostWed Apr 02, 2014 2:57 pm

I'd like to clarify something: your feedbacks are really important to us.
They really are.
But this doesn't mean that we immediately take everything that some players could write out of rage in some threads and put it in our game untested.

We are a small team of people working closely together (Legulysse, me, and other people that might not post so much but that are as important as us in the decision process) and we already have our own opinion on what's happening in the game.
On everything that happens in the game, actually.

So, sometimes, someone here (in fact, many people here) reports things that we already thought were problems.
And that's good. That means that what we already thought was wrong, was indeed wrong, and needs a fix.

Sometimes, if the timing is right, it is possible that a discussion about the matter sparks again.
And if that's a quick and easy fix, one of us can sometimes take on its time to fix it for good.

Usually it ends up with Legulysse or Bousk doing it, but they never act on their own about that kind of stuff and it's always with the team aknowledgement and agreement.


... so, for the scatter shot, for example, we've been thinking about it for a while. Scattering behind hard cover is not an intended behavior, and exploiting the scatter formula to artificially raise one's chances to hit an enemy target in a melee where every individual enemy is at a 1% chance to be hit, is not intended either.


tl;dr
The form of the post (rage posts, impulsive posts, whining, etc) do not matter at all for us.
We only care about the ideas that are behind your feedbacks.
We have our own perspective on our game and when everyone in our team agrees that something is good for the game, even if some of you guys do not agree with it on the forum, then we do it anyway.
Then we listen to you guys and if we agree with you that something is still wrong, we think about it some more and try to fix the new problem if we think there is one.

I hope I do not offend anyone by saying that - I do not mean to be rude with this statement - but it's just how we're working here, and I expect it's the case with a great deal of game developpers around the world.



Dragon_Warrior wrote:- Scattering ignorinf the fov? Its same as tabletop option to attack hidden units with blast attack only if there is visible enemy in the same range. Simply you can't cheat the game that you see hidden enemy and shoot there with volley fire - but if you shoot to close visible target and scatter... additionaly all arrows reflected by armors/shields can also be quite harmfull to units close to initial target ;P


Well, it is not artillery fire in this case, and the chance to actually hit someone behind a rock with that sort of scattering should not be that high. In fact, it should be negligible. So it is not working as intended.
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Dragon_Warrior

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Re: Sigh...

PostWed Apr 02, 2014 3:45 pm

Well, it is not artillery fire in this case, and the chance to actually hit someone behind a rock with that sort of scattering should not be that high. In fact, it should be negligible. So it is not working as intended.

i agree that its minimal and this aspect can be changed - im ok with that.

But im a big fan of:
... so, for the scatter shot, for example, we've been thinking about it for a while. Scattering behind hard cover is not an intended behavior, and exploiting the scatter formula to artificially raise one's chances to hit an enemy target in a melee where every individual enemy is at a 1% chance to be hit, is not intended either.

When I have 1% of hitting initial target because its hidden in the circle of enemies - its ok
but ist even more realistic that i have over 60% for hitting 'something' ... no matter what - it matters only that its inside big group of enemy models.

Its most annoying part of tabletop games when game mechanic must be simplified as possible (for a easy and fast counting reason) and missing initial target 'desintegrates' the arrow no matter if there is wall of models in front of or behind that model. In DoW when all % are calculated by game alone - its really great thing that i can im in group - not in particular unit - and all this without any special or complicated skills - only by simple shot made Vs big group of enemy units...
additionaly its great with countering turtle formations and gave me many wins when i was playing RAM complany with 4-5 bowmans aiming in groups and not in particular models ;)
ign: Draconnor, Cynwall player, 23 years in computer games, 14 years in battle games, 8 years in Confrontation Universe, 4 years of making own battle games.
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Dragon_Warrior

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Re: Sigh...

PostWed Apr 02, 2014 5:19 pm

Deep Blue wrote:
Dragon_Warrior wrote:
I think the missile fire in this has way better mechanics than other games of its type. Be careful what you change with scatter Legulysse. People start threads about rare bad luck just after they rage quit a game. This should not lead to patching.

+this


++ this :D

about rage and games

once again im against survival instinct skill in current way...

its useles or broken...

i just lost game Vs two units with survival... my whole army bounced from this units
5 quite lucky parries and 6+ survival saves followed by counteratack
ign: Draconnor, Cynwall player, 23 years in computer games, 14 years in battle games, 8 years in Confrontation Universe, 4 years of making own battle games.
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